Graphics/Engineering workstation build.

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Graphics/Engineering workstation build.

Postby RollingCamel » Mon Jun 16, 2014 10:17 pm

Hello all. Good to be back :)

Now I'm assigned to build a new graphics/engineering workstation build. Budget is around $5500. I'll do some research myself but I'm open for suggestions.

-Akram
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Re: Graphics/Engineering workstation build.

Postby DIREWOLF75 » Tue Jun 17, 2014 3:05 am

Welcome back.

"land of Porsche"... :mrgreen:

Now I'm assigned to build a new graphics/engineering workstation build. Budget is around $5500. I'll do some research myself but I'm open for suggestions.


Nice. So, what level of requirements/performance is it you need to aim for?

One big divider is wether you need a workstation gfx card or if a regular one will suffice. Based on the budget i assume you need a workstation card.

Then cpu, if a single i7 is enough, the brand new refresh from Intel, the i7 4690K might be suitable, while it´s not set up specifically for workstations, it runs at 4/4.4Ghz so it should net quite a nice performance for a single cpu.

But then, the budget says you might be looking for something Xeonbased, or possibly a multi-cpu system?

It´s been a while since i looked at workstation builds so please excuse the rust included. :wink:
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Re: Graphics/Engineering workstation build.

Postby Hammer_Time » Tue Jun 17, 2014 3:41 am

Hi Akram, good to hear from you! :D

As Dire mentioned, what exactly will you be using this workstation for? AutoCad most likely right? Please list all programs that you intend to run on this thing, that will help us give you a better solution - one that is custom tuned for the apps you need to use on it of course. :)

Are you involved with any car/racing projects anymore? Just curious...

Anyhoo hope you and your wife are doing well lately.. any baby Akrams in your future??

Cheers...
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Re: Graphics/Engineering workstation build.

Postby Hammer_Time » Tue Jun 17, 2014 3:43 am

DIREWOLF75 wrote:It´s been a while since i looked at workstation builds so please excuse the rust included. :wink:


:lol: Same here... :mrgreen: :whistle:
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Re: Graphics/Engineering workstation build.

Postby RollingCamel » Tue Jun 17, 2014 5:18 am

DIREWOLF75 wrote:Welcome back.

"land of Porsche"... :mrgreen:


I have moved to Dubai so it is land of freak'n LandCruisers now...


Hi Akram, good to hear from you! :D

As Dire mentioned, what exactly will you be using this workstation for? AutoCad most likely right? Please list all programs that you intend to run on this thing, that will help us give you a better solution - one that is custom tuned for the apps you need to use on it of course. :)

Are you involved with any car/racing projects anymore? Just curious...

Anyhoo hope you and your wife are doing well lately.. any baby Akrams in your future??

Cheers...


The AutoCAD is more of "but can it play Doom?" in engineering workstations. Software will be run would be Rhino3D, Solidworks, Keyshot and other stuff. Multithreading performance is effective but so is clockspeed plus lots of memory.

Also I'm working with 3D scan data which consumes mighty mounts of memory.

I'm now part of NSV Auto where we design and manufacture automotive OEM accessories. Design center in Dubai and branches in Taiwan, China, Australia, USA and one guy in Japan :)

No kids still although had a close call :)


The latest PC we bought had 4770k with 32 Gbs, SSD and stuff. Need to top it :D
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Re: Graphics/Engineering workstation build.

Postby DIREWOLF75 » Tue Jun 17, 2014 6:47 am

The latest PC we bought had 4770k with 32 Gbs, SSD and stuff. Need to top it :D


Ok... So if the RAM is enough then you COULD go for the 4790K, as it is an extra 500Mhz, still that feels a bit on the lowend for an upgrade.

Meaning you could look at the i7 4960X, that almost doubles the L3, allows you to run 64GB of RAM and gives you an extra 2 cores.

Now, from what i vaguely recall, Autocad tends to run singlethread? Which would mean greatly favouring the 4790K, while at least Rhino3D multithreads heavily, which would probably favour the 4960X, as it is optimised for multihreaded applications (takes 10-30% hit in singlethreaded compared to 4770 at same clock)...

It´s annoying that the "regular" i7 can´t go above 32GB of RAM, if it could i would simply just recommend the 4790K, but since those kind of apps can be severe RAM hogs, you might get more from doubling the RAM than you get from raising the clockspeed by half a gig.

And then of course, the 4960X costs almost three times as much as the 4790K, and the motherboards for them tend to be more expensive as well.

If you can stick with 32GB RAM without really loosing too much(and unless that extra L3 is worth LOTS), i will say go with 4790K and get faster RAM since you can´t get more. There was a test posted a while ago that tested how much RAM speeds helped, and up to 2400Mhz, the improvements were surprisingly decent.

So, 4790K+32GB DDR3 2133 or 2400 as the basic package? (above those RAM speeds, price tends to jump more, and in the test they actually found reduced performance in some benchmarks when going above 2400Mhz RAM)

Or, if the extra L3/extra RAM/extra cores is worth a lot, 4960X+64GB DDR3 1600 or 1866. The pricetag for this is MUCH higher though.

I have moved to Dubai so it is land of freak'n LandCruisers now...

:D
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Re: Graphics/Engineering workstation build.

Postby RollingCamel » Tue Jun 17, 2014 8:21 am

Okay I went for the shop we normally buy from.

I'm looking for at the following:

CPU Intel i7 4930K
Mobo - Asus P9x79
SSD Kingston HyperX 3k SSD 2x240GB or 1x 480 GB both will cost the same but don't know which way id better.
Quadro K4000
64GB RAM

These are the main components I believe.
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Re: Graphics/Engineering workstation build.

Postby DIREWOLF75 » Tue Jun 17, 2014 10:19 am

RollingCamel wrote:Okay I went for the shop we normally buy from.

I'm looking for at the following:

CPU Intel i7 4930K
Mobo - Asus P9x79
SSD Kingston HyperX 3k SSD 2x240GB or 1x 480 GB both will cost the same but don't know which way id better.
Quadro K4000
64GB RAM

These are the main components I believe.


Ok, do note though that the 4930K have lower clockspeed than your previous 4770K and has a 12MB L3 rather than the huge 15MB of the 4960X, so coupled with how they´re optimised for multithreaded, anything you run singlethreaded on this will likely be a lot slower than on the 4770K system.

Of course, if the 4770K system isn´t actually dead, you could retain that for the Autocad and anything else that prefers singlethreaded.

And for the SSDs, well if you get 2 then you could have them run in RAID 0... Just make sure you have something to do backup on daily if you do.

Oh, and make sure you don´t get anything slower than DDR3-1600, the price differences below that are minimal, and you can probably get -1866 for nearly the same price as -1600.
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Re: Graphics/Engineering workstation build.

Postby Hammer_Time » Tue Jun 17, 2014 10:46 am

RollingCamel wrote:Okay I went for the shop we normally buy from.

I'm looking for at the following:

CPU Intel i7 4930K
Mobo - Asus P9x79
SSD Kingston HyperX 3k SSD 2x240GB or 1x 480 GB both will cost the same but don't know which way id better.
Quadro K4000
64GB RAM

These are the main components I believe.


Very nice!! If you put two of those HyperX SSD's in RAID 0 you will get nearly double the read performance, with same write performance of course. If you are not afraid of risking data loss ( drives these days are quite reliable so chances of this happening are very slim, but there is still a chance it might happen ). If you feel that the risk of data loss is too high with RAID 0 then stick with a single large SSD of course.

I like these for professional workstations:

http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.as ... -_-Product

OCZ RevoDrive 350 Series RVD350-FHPX28-480G PCI-E 480GB PCI-Express 2.0 x8 MLC Internal Solid State Drive (SSD)

$899.99


http://www.techspot.com/review/808-ocz- ... -350-pcie/

While the RevoDrive 350 models are much cheaper than previous versions, the drives are still very expensive. Our 480GB review sample carries a retail tag of $830, 50% more expensive than the Samsung SSD 840 Pro 512GB.
Of course, for this price you are getting four LSI SandForce SF-2282 controllers in RAID0. That said, four OCZ Vertex 460 120GB drives would cost just $400, making the RevoDrive 350 480GB more than twice as expensive, which is a little shocking.
On the other hand, the RevoDrive 350 offers a much more convenient way to go about RAID0. Four SATA SSD drives require four SATA ports supporting RAID that are connected to a high performance chipset, the RevoDrive 350 simply requires a PCI Express x8/x16 slot.

In terms of performance, users are looking at claimed read and write throughputs of 1800MB/s and 1700MB/s for the 480GB/960GB models. The smaller 240GB model claims less impressive numbers of 1000MB/s read and 950MB/s write, which is because the 240GB version only has two LSI SandForce 2282 controllers.

For the 480GB and 960GB models, the four SandForce 2282 controllers are connected internally via the four-port OCZ RAID controller -- little is known about this except that coupled with the controller is a virtualized software layer called VCA (Virtualized Controller Architecture 2.0). In short, VCA enables many features that were present on previous RevoDrives, such as TRIM. Other supported features include SMART monitoring, NCQ, TCQ, power failure management, as well as wear-leveling.
The advantage to using PCIe x8 opposed to the SATA interface is that it provides far more bandwidth. The Serial ATA 6Gb/s bus is only capable of connecting devices at transfer speeds of about 600MB/s. The RevoDrive 350 uses the PCI Express 2.0 8x bus which allows speeds of up to 4GB/s.

Final Thoughts
Given that the OCZ Vector 150 and Vertex 460 are both based on the Indilinx Barefoot 3 controller and paired with Toshiba's 19nm MLC NAND, we are surprised that the RevoDrive 350 reverts to the LSI SandForce 2282 -- a controller used back in 2011 by the discontinued Vertex 3. We expected the Barefoot 3 to take center stage but this isn't the case.
Nonetheless, with the right flash memory the SandForce 2282 is good for sequential read and write transfers of up to 500MB/s (@ 128KB blocks), so four of them working together were never going to be slow. The RevoDrive 350 provided the best results we've seen in our file copy test, being an average of 120% faster than the Samsung SSD 840 Pro 512GB.


Damn expensive, but also great performance! If your budget allows for an expensive SSD like this one it might be worth considering... all the rest of your components sound good!

RollingCamel wrote:The AutoCAD is more of "but can it play Doom?" in engineering workstations. Software will be run would be Rhino3D, Solidworks, Keyshot and other stuff. Multithreading performance is effective but so is clockspeed plus lots of memory.

Also I'm working with 3D scan data which consumes mighty mounts of memory.

I'm now part of NSV Auto where we design and manufacture automotive OEM accessories. Design center in Dubai and branches in Taiwan, China, Australia, USA and one guy in Japan :)

No kids still although had a close call :)



The latest PC we bought had 4770k with 32 Gbs, SSD and stuff. Need to top it :D


Cool, I always knew you would wind up working for an automotive company ( or automotive-related ) ! 8)

Close call with having kids eh? Don't worry, am sure that eventually one day it will happen...

Then you can have fun getting your kid something like this to play with:

http://www.caranddriver.com/features/in ... ng-feature

:D
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Re: Graphics/Engineering workstation build.

Postby RollingCamel » Tue Jun 17, 2014 11:25 am

WE DON'T USE AUTOCAD!! H_T is the one who mentioned it! We use highly threaded programs as rendering programs and point cloud data.

Ok here is what was finalized after a chat with the boss...

Same cpu and mobo.
32GB memory
Crucial MX100 512GB SSD
1TB WD Black HDD x3
2x 24" Dell
Quaro K4000 3GB
Thermaltake Frio Extreme cpu cooler
Thermaltake PSU 850W


Case still not certain of. My boss want something that wows yet subtle.

There is the Antec P280, Thermaltake Chaser and Thermaltake LeveL 10 GT
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Re: Graphics/Engineering workstation build.

Postby Hammer_Time » Tue Jun 17, 2014 3:29 pm

RollingCamel wrote:WE DON'T USE AUTOCAD!! H_T is the one who mentioned it! We use highly threaded programs as rendering programs and point cloud data.

Ok here is what was finalized after a chat with the boss...

Same cpu and mobo.
32GB memory
Crucial MX100 512GB SSD
1TB WD Black HDD x3
2x 24" Dell
Quaro K4000 3GB
Thermaltake Frio Extreme cpu cooler
Thermaltake PSU 850W


Case still not certain of. My boss want something that wows yet subtle.

There is the Antec P280, Thermaltake Chaser and Thermaltake LeveL 10 GT


:lol: :lol: :mrgreen: Don't get mad...

Back on topic, your system looks very impressive now. Regarding the 3 cases you mentioned, the Thermaltake level 10 GT case is awesome indeed!

All 3 cases are "winners" imho, but if budget allows you should get that Level 10 GT case , gorgeous!!

You mentioned 3 x 1 GB WD hdd's, are you going to RAID them or something? Why not single 3 TB WD hdd as that would be cheaper? Or are you going to mirror data on them, or have 3 in case 1 fails etc for redundancy...just curious...
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Re: Graphics/Engineering workstation build.

Postby DIREWOLF75 » Tue Jun 17, 2014 5:50 pm

WE DON'T USE AUTOCAD!! H_T is the one who mentioned it! We use highly threaded programs as rendering programs and point cloud data.


*eeep* :whistle:

Sorry, my mistake and HT taking after the evil ways of Sauron and spreading confusion. :wink:

Your reply to HT made me think you meant that it was so obvious that it shouldn´t even have to be mentioned.

:incoming:

Case still not certain of. My boss want something that wows yet subtle.

There is the Antec P280, Thermaltake Chaser and Thermaltake LeveL 10 GT


If you want something that stands out, then the Level 10 GT, i think the Chaser is the most stylish, while the Antec for an understated, low profile "cool".

Bit hard to manage both "wows" AND "subtle" with the same case though... :?


Same cpu and mobo.
32GB memory
Crucial MX100 512GB SSD
1TB WD Black HDD x3
2x 24" Dell
Quaro K4000 3GB
Thermaltake Frio Extreme cpu cooler
Thermaltake PSU 850W


Should work fine.

Though if you have the budget for it, go with 64GB RAM all at once so you can reduce the risk of getting stuck with RAM sets that doesn´t like each other.

The MX100 is just released and seems to be getting very good reviews while being the first decent SSD that doesn´t cost you half a brand new system by itself.
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Re: Graphics/Engineering workstation build.

Postby Hammer_Time » Tue Jun 17, 2014 11:28 pm

Yep, the new Crucial MX100 SSD is very good "Bang for the Buck":

http://www.thessdreview.com/our-reviews ... 56-512-gb/

The Crucial MX100 is a great step forward in the consumer SSD market. We support purchase of the M550 with our Top Value award. It is riddled with so many data integrity features and such impressive performance for the low MSRP, it really deserves it.


http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6820148821

$220 clams on newegg, nice price!! $35 cheaper than the Samsung 840 EVO 500 GB drive on newegg:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... -_-Product

The Samsung 840 EVO series used to be the best bang for your buck ( performance/price ratio ) but with this low pricing Crucial has just stolen that title with their MX100 series, and you get all the "bells and whistles" with it as well ( data integrity features etc, just like the Samsung drives have ). 8)
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Re: Graphics/Engineering workstation build.

Postby Sauron_Daz » Thu Jun 19, 2014 3:12 am

RollingCamel wrote:WE DON'T USE AUTOCAD!!

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Graphics/Engineering workstation build.

Postby Sauron_Daz » Thu Jun 19, 2014 3:13 am

RollingCamel wrote:Hello all. Good to be back :)

Now I'm assigned to build a new graphics/engineering workstation build. Budget is around $5500. I'll do some research myself but I'm open for suggestions.

-Akram

Welcome back!!
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Re: Graphics/Engineering workstation build.

Postby Sauron_Daz » Thu Jun 19, 2014 3:13 am

DIREWOLF75 wrote:
WE DON'T USE AUTOCAD!! H_T is the one who mentioned it! We use highly threaded programs as rendering programs and point cloud data.


*eeep* :whistle:

Sorry, my mistake and HT taking after the evil ways of Sauron and spreading confusion. :wink:

:lol:
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Re: Graphics/Engineering workstation build.

Postby Sauron_Daz » Thu Jun 19, 2014 3:15 am

Hammer_Time wrote:The Samsung 840 EVO series used to be the best bang for your buck ( performance/price ratio ) but with this low pricing Crucial has just stolen that title with their MX100 series, and you get all the "bells and whistles" with it as well ( data integrity features etc, just like the Samsung drives have ). 8)


Good. Then the price of all SSD's should come down now.
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Re: Graphics/Engineering workstation build.

Postby DIREWOLF75 » Thu Jun 19, 2014 3:20 am

Sauron_Daz wrote:
Good. Then the price of all SSD's should come down now.


I wouldn´t count on it. I hope and wish, but definitely wouldn´t count on it.
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Re: Graphics/Engineering workstation build.

Postby RollingCamel » Thu Jun 19, 2014 11:34 am

Got the PC.

Bought 2 Dell 24" eIPS screens with 1920x1200 resolution, great aspect ratio. Also, got the Antec P280 which looks dull to say...My boss ain't happy at all. Furthermore, a Razer Blackwidow mechanical keyboard, while way better I think it will get on coworkers' nerves :)
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Re: Graphics/Engineering workstation build.

Postby Hammer_Time » Thu Jun 19, 2014 8:09 pm

Nice!! The Antec P280 is not the "flashiest" of cases but it certainly gets the job done, in a subtle understated way.

Have you built the tower yet? If so the please give us your 3DMark score! :mrgreen: :wink: :twisted: :lol: ( just kidding of course ). Hope the system is suitably fast for your needs! Are you the only user of this new system or do you have to share it with others?

Those Dell eIPS monitors have a fantastic picture, enjoy!!

Very nice keyboard you got, even it is clickety clackety loud! At least the keyboard noise will make your boss think you are working hard!! :wink: :scout: :lol:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pgECVsN9RNM

8)
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