new pc, ram related question

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new pc, ram related question

Postby tommytee » Wed Oct 30, 2013 10:02 am

hi Folks,
been too many years since my last upgrade and I am looking to put a new workstation together, Seems I need a quick crash course in hardward

the mobo i am looking at is the Asus P9X79 WS Intel X79.
Regarding the ram, it can take up-to 64GB, I'll probably go with 32GB

Memory Type is listed as DDR3 (non ecc)
Memory Channel is listed as 'Quad'
the board has 8 ram slots in it

Question: what does the quad mean, does it mean I can only use the ram in batches of 4 sticks, 1 x (4x8gb) and leave the other 4 slots empty or i could fill all slots with 4gb in each,?

whilst I'm here is it good practice to use a SSD for the OS and then an IDE drives for work files?

as always I appreciate any help offered
thanks
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Re: new pc, ram related question

Postby Hammer_Time » Wed Oct 30, 2013 11:36 am

That is a nice workstation board, good reviews too!

http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.as ... 6813131798

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/p9x ... 86-16.html

Test System Configuration

CPU Intel Core i7-3960X (Sandy Bridge-E): 3.60 GHz, 15 MB Cache, LGA 2011, Turbo Boost enabled
CPU Cooler Swiftech Apogee GTX, MCP 655b, Triple Fan Radiator Kit
RAM G.Skill F3-17600CL9Q-16GBXLD 16 GB (4 x 4 GB) DDR3-2200
Benchmarked at 4 x 4 GB DDR3-1600 CAS 9 defaults


Though we had a reasonably broad selection of candidates, firmware issues left us considering only the two products that came closest to our expectations. Asus’ P9X79 WS had the best performance, best overclocking, lowest power consumption, and greatest number of expansion slots. Meanwhile its P9X79 Deluxe followed closely behind the WS version, but added a bunch of lifestyle-oriented features like Bluetooth, Wi-Fi, and a greater number of USB 3.0 rear-panel ports (even though several ports share bandwidth). The added features are surely worth a little more than the miniscule differences in performance. And yet both boards are priced the same.


http://www.bjorn3d.com/2012/03/asus-p9x ... therboard/

CONCLUSION

When reviewing the WS board we really had to put ourselves in the perspective of what kind of user ASUS has in mind here, and with the major amounts of work computers do these days, there is a very large market for it. One area we do not think is aware of this board would be some of the users we see now days who do rendering from their home and also like to smash on the newest games out there. With its stability, compatibility, and its ability to overclock with some of the best out there, this board could be a viable option for anyone looking for a high-performance board with server level features.

All is very good with this board but there were some things we saw which we feel could be improved on, such as the omission of eSATA natively on the back panel. While it does include an eSATA bracket, we also know that there could be even a single eSATA port on the rear panel since many of the rear slots could easily be filled with multiple compute cards or graphics processors. We do understand that there are some sacrifices that must be made especially when talking about adding yet another controller plus to ensure server level stability and compatibility..
Also, onboard WiFi and/or Bluetooth is something we would like to see, but we know the dual Intel network controllers are more ideal than onboard WiFi.
We really tried to see what we could come up with that we would find ourselves wanting with this board but they just flat out run and they run well. We also found some more performance when overclocking which makes this board just that much better. This board has most of the capability of the ROG counterparts, albeit with a little more complicated tuning.


Awesome workstation board...highly recommended.

Support for up to 64GB of system memory with an 8-DIMM design on ASUS X79 motherboards provides the capacity for users to make full use of modern 64-bit software, ideal for rendering detailed images or manipulating large files without the bottlenecks of conventional storage. It also allows users to set up big RAM disks and speed up frequently accessed programs, minimizing the impact of storage transfer delays while maximizing user benefit.


What is quad-channel memory? :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multi-chan ... chitecture

In the fields of digital electronics and computer hardware, multi-channel memory architecture is a technology that increases the transfer speed of data between the DRAM memory and the chipset memory controller by adding more channels of communication between them. Theoretically this multiplies the data rate by exactly the number of channels present. Dual-channel memory employs two channels which theoretically doubles the data transfer rate. The technique goes back as far as the 1960s having been used in IBM System/360 Model 91 and in CDC 6600.[1]

Modern higher-end chipsets like the Intel i7-9x series and various Xeon chipsets support triple-channel memory. In March 2010 AMD released Socket G34 and Magny-Cours Opteron 6100 series[2] processors which support quad-channel memory. In 2006 Intel released chipsets that support quad-channel memory for their LGA771 platform[3] and later in 2011 for their LGA2011 platform.[4] Microcomputer chipsets with even more channels were designed: for example, the chipset in the AlphaStation 600 (1995) supported eight-channel memory, but the backplane of the machine limited operation to four channels.[5]


Quadruple-channel architecture

Operation

DDR3 Quadruple-channel architecture is used in the AMD G34 platform and the Intel LGA 2011 platform (e.g., Intel X79). AMD processors which are used on the C32 platform instead use dual-channel DDR3 memory. Intel processors which are used on the LGA 1155 platform (e.g., Intel Z68) instead use dual-channel DDR3 memory.

The architecture can only be used when all four, or a multiple of four, memory modules are identical in capacity and speed, and are placed in quad-channel slots. When two memory modules are installed, the architecture will operate in dual-channel architecture mode. When three memory modules are installed, the architecture will operate in triple-channel architecture mode
.[10]


Since the Asus P9X79 series motherboards use 8 memory slots ( channels ), if you fill up all 8 slots with ram then it operates in 2 x Quad-Channel memory mode ( first 4 sticks of ram form a "Quad Channel" in which all 4 slots can be accessed simultaneously. The next 4 sticks of ram form another bank of "Quad Channel" memory ).

Ideally you want to fill up at least 4 slots with ram in order to enable "Quad Channel" memory, up to you if you want to fill up the other 4 slots ( for capacity, not speed increase after first 4 ram slots are filled ).

Happy shopping! :)

To answer your other question, yes, by all means use a fast SSD for OS and apps, and IDE or SATA HDD's for large data storage ( SATA drives preferred over IDE of course, do you still have some IDE drives that you wish to use...if buying new SATA is highly preferred, especially in a workstation environment ).
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Re: new pc, ram related question

Postby tommytee » Wed Oct 30, 2013 1:59 pm

super thanks for that,
Starting off with 32gb with the intention of adding in another 32gb, I'd be better off to go with 4x8bg and fill the first 4 channels, so that if I wanted to add more ram at a later date I would fill remaining 4 with identical to the first 4 slots, rather than fill all 8 slots with 4gb in each,

:oops: SATA of course over IDE

Much appreciated,
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Re: new pc, ram related question

Postby Sauron_Daz » Wed Oct 30, 2013 4:42 pm

tommytee wrote: :oops: SATA of course over IDE

Much appreciated,
Tommyt


And SSD over whatever else, at least for the drive holding the OS!!
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Re: new pc, ram related question

Postby mhudon » Fri Nov 01, 2013 4:59 am

Quad channel memory means that you need to fill at least 4 memory bank to be able to benefit from this architecture. Would the workstation work with only 2 memory stick? YES! Would it be optimal? NO!

If your goal is to upgrade to 64GB in the near future, the best thing would indeed be to buy a 4x8gb kit know (enabling the quad channel) and another later.

IMPORTANT THING TO KNOW: Frequency and timing written on memory kits is only guaranteed for this particular single kit. If you add a second kit of the same memory in a computer, ram makers will not guarantee that it will work at the same frequency/timimg/voltage. It might work (and usually does for standard DDR3-1333/1600 kits) but with more exotic kits you might have to lower frequency or increase voltage to make it happen.


I'm building a video editing rig based on the same motherboard. It's a very nice choice. Depending on the application, I would definitely recommend including SSD drives to your set-up.

For video editing, I've included one SSD (256GB) for the OS, one SSD (512GB) to hold the projects during their completion and a standard sata3 2TB drive as a workhorse where data is stored for a while.

This way you greatly optimise encoding speed and application performance in Adobe After Effect, Adobe Premiere Pro and Cinema 4D.
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Re: new pc, ram related question

Postby Hammer_Time » Fri Nov 01, 2013 5:09 am

Yes, exactly! BTW, if you really want to speed up your video/photo apps, you could use a large RAMdrive , that really makes them sing...at risk of losing your data of course if power is ever interrupted...

tommytee wrote:super thanks for that,
Starting off with 32gb with the intention of adding in another 32gb, I'd be better off to go with 4x8bg and fill the first 4 channels, so that if I wanted to add more ram at a later date I would fill remaining 4 with identical to the first 4 slots, rather than fill all 8 slots with 4gb in each,

:oops: SATA of course over IDE

Much appreciated,
Tommyt




TommyT plans to fill first 4 slots ( 4 x 8 GB = 32GB total ), then, if needed in the future, to fill last 4 ram slots with identical ram ( as he stated above ). So he is good to go, Quad-channel will be enabled that way. BTW you are welcome TommyT for any and all advice given here, happy shopping! :)
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Re: new pc, ram related question

Postby Sauron_Daz » Fri Nov 01, 2013 6:24 am

Hammer_Time wrote:Yes, exactly! BTW, if you really want to speed up your video/photo apps, you could use a large RAMdrive , that really makes them sing...at risk of losing your data of course if power is ever interrupted...


That would be....unfortunate.
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Re: new pc, ram related question

Postby Hammer_Time » Fri Nov 01, 2013 7:37 am

to say the least... ramdrives are impressive but the data is always at risk of course... :?
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Re: new pc, ram related question

Postby tommytee » Fri Nov 01, 2013 11:29 am

Great advice,

just on the topic of the SSD drive , i take it its the SATA III 2.5 Drives I would be looking to spec, what brands would you advise?

(I really have taken my eyes off the hardware scene over the past few years :(

thanks
T
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Re: new pc, ram related question

Postby mhudon » Fri Nov 01, 2013 11:47 am

Xbit editors really put a lot of efforts in bringing the community many detailed reviews on the latest SSD drive. You should spend some time to read them in the Storage section of the site!

Professionally, I favor both Samsung 840 Pro and Plextor M5 Pro Extreme for their performance, reliability and availability. Intel drives are great, but Intel makes enough money selling expensive CPU's, I prefer supporting diversity.

Personally, I could only afford Mushkin Enhance Chronos Deluxe SSD's offering a better price/performance ratio at the time. 480gb drives for only $341 about a year ago. 240gb for $170 two weeks ago. Both 480gb drives performs well without issue. The 240gb performs well too!
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Re: new pc, ram related question

Postby Hammer_Time » Fri Nov 01, 2013 2:16 pm

Agreed with Mhudon's post above!

Personally, if on a tight budget, then Samsung 840 EVO drive ( performance in between base 840 drive and the top line model 840 PRO ) at a very affordable price!

If you can afford the 840 Pro then go for it, very reliable and overall speedy SSD drive...

The Mushkin Enhance Chronos Deluxe and Plextor SSD's mentioned above are also excellent drives...decisions decisions...

The 840 Pro is universally recognized in nearly every SSD hw review site "shootout" as the best/fastest overall Desktop SSD drive right now...a few other drives can match it, but you can't go wrong buying any of the Samsung 840 series imho... happy shopping!
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Re: new pc, ram related question

Postby Sauron_Daz » Fri Nov 01, 2013 6:35 pm

Hammer_Time wrote:to say the least... ramdrives are impressive but the data is always at risk of course... :?

Enter SSD, the next best thing.

As you know so well..
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Re: new pc, ram related question

Postby Sauron_Daz » Fri Nov 01, 2013 6:36 pm

mhudon wrote:Professionally, I favor both Samsung 840 Pro and Plextor M5 Pro Extreme for their performance, reliability and availability. Intel drives are great, but Intel makes enough money selling expensive CPU's, I prefer supporting diversity.


Hear hear!!
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Re: new pc, ram related question

Postby Hammer_Time » Sat Nov 02, 2013 8:09 pm

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/ssd ... 269-3.html
Best SSDs For The Money: October 2013

By Christopher Ryan
OCTOBER 28, 2013

One Of The Fastest Ever

The 256 GB Samsung 840 Pro is fast. Unreasonably, face-meltingly fast, even. It once rose indisputably above all other performance-oriented SATA 6Gb/s-capable SSDs packing MLC flash. Now, OCZ's Vector and SanDisk's Extreme II are in the same ballpark. Prior to those newcomers, the only drive that could stand up to Samsung's 840 Pro was Plextor’s excellent M5 Pro. In measures of overall performance, though, there are few faster than the Pro from South Korea. As such, Samsung has a deserved reputation as the enthusiast’s choice when fast is all that counts.
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Re: new pc, ram related question

Postby Sauron_Daz » Sun Nov 03, 2013 2:41 am

That drive is just over 200 Euro's here..
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Re: new pc, ram related question

Postby gracie » Sun Nov 03, 2013 5:31 am

I have the 840pro SSD 256gb.. It is a fast reliable drive.. Now tho, my choice would be to go with the 840Evo 250gb SSD. A little cheaper and is withing a few % points
of the Pro. Samsung is also one of the most reliable SSD"s on the market.
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Re: new pc, ram related question

Postby Hammer_Time » Sun Nov 03, 2013 5:33 am

Thanks Gracie, agreed! :D
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Re: new pc, ram related question

Postby Sauron_Daz » Sun Nov 03, 2013 2:17 pm

Seconded. :D
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Re: new pc, ram related question

Postby Kahless » Wed Nov 13, 2013 2:47 am

I have the 840 pro 256giger and it is really fast! I think the EVO has less of a warranty than the pro but they are pretty reliable anyways.
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Re: new pc, ram related question

Postby Sauron_Daz » Wed Nov 13, 2013 2:53 am

Less of a warrenty? How so?
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