Windows 8 - opinion

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Windows 8 - opinion

Postby Stupify » Thu Jul 25, 2013 1:03 pm

what most people can't seem to wrap their head around is what windows 8 meant and why it was released and the timings. I have said it numerous times and will say it again.

What W8 means?
Windows 8 was a testing OS to drive computers/pcs into the next generation of computing - tablets, clouds, touch screens, ... These are some very complex and very demanding endeavors to take on in a single OS that is so widely used - not only by numbers but also for purpose [gaming, professionals, hosting, media consumption, ...] - and to get it right in one go. But W8 isn't stupidly bad but rather does not offer a smooth transition from "olden" days and older programs.

Why it was released?
It was released to sort of beta test out the next generation of computing. And it served that purpose well. Lots of complains/feedback got taken in and Windows 8.1 comes about. Even that I believe will be another beta OS but something that Microsoft has to do to transition the masses to the new interfaces and give sufficient time for all the program makers to deliver a working usable program. Can you imagine trying to build an OS that delivers on both fronts and perfectly satisfy them?

The timings
See the funny thing here is that most people bitching about Windows 8 use Windows 7's "perfection" as an argument, but at the same time fail to realize that it is exactly that that provided the opportunity for the new venture into the next generation computing that Windows 8 represents. When the world is perfectly happy with Windows 7, why not beta test out new OS (GUI and what not specifically) and give a product that software makers and PC makers can use to build on.

So why go and bitch about Windows 8 being horrible compared to Windows 7? If one is happy with Windows 7 then they ought to stay with it. You don't have to continue using/upgrade to Windows 8 if you do not want to. I understand there is the part where Windows 8 is being forced down your throat when you pick up a new system but part of the necessary beta testing needed. :)

Oh and I don't believe we will get a solid replacement for Windows 7 for a while similar to how Windows XP was. But I can say for sure is that Windows 7 style GUI is done with and ought to be as much as I hate to say and admit it for the next generation of computing.


PS - I have yet to use Windows 8 full time, just used it briefly now and then while helping relatives fix their issues.
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Re: Windows 8 - opinion

Postby Sauron_Daz » Thu Jul 25, 2013 2:08 pm

You may be right, but my ( and my wife's) greater worries is: how the %&$# do I keep that touch-sensitive monitor clean when its already difficult to do so now with the ones we don't touch..
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Re: Windows 8 - opinion

Postby Hammer_Time » Thu Jul 25, 2013 2:15 pm

I think Windows 8 is great for Touch-enabled devices like Tablets etc.

I think it is a waste of time on a traditional desktop pc ( one without a touch-screen of course ), W7 works fine on a desktop pc. Not against "change" , but the change must make "sense".

Windows 8 makes sense on a Tablet or device with Touch-enabled screen. Does not make as much sense on a traditional desktop pc ( imho ).

So it all depends on what "device" you are talking about, when pitting the pros and cons of Windows 8 vs Windows 7...

If you use and like Windows 8 , then great , enjoy, more power to you!! Personally, I see no reason to switch to Windows 8 ( 8.1 now ) from Windows 7 on my desktop pc as I am more than happy with W7 atm, everything works, I went through some hw issues a while ago as you know, but since the hw was replaced with good components, my computer is super stable now and, hasn't crashed on me in months!! :scout: 8) :D

The people who are bitching and moaning that Windows 8 "sucks" compared to Windows 7, are mostly those trying to use W8 on a non-Touch enabled device, such as a traditional desktop pc or notebook that does not have a "touch-sensitive screen"... most of the benefits of W8 are had with the Touch feature enabled...that is why M$ is in the situation it is in currently regarding W8... W8 has a much higher learning curve than W7 does, and yes, W8 does boot up slightly faster than W7, and is a little more efficient when it comes to system memory usage, but the average user will most likely never notice those differences, especially on a fast modern system to start with... the REAL benefit of W8 is the Touch interface, and if you run W8 on a device that can't use that feature, then what is the point of having W8 on that system... that is why people are bitching...not cuz they "hate change" so much...but the "change" must benefit them noticeably for them to embrace it, and W8 on a desktop pc just does not do that really...

If I ever bought a Tablet, I would want either Windows 8.x on it ( or latest Android 4.x OS ) of course ( not an Apple fan mostly due to their outrageous pricing )...
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Re: Windows 8 - opinion

Postby Sauron_Daz » Thu Jul 25, 2013 2:27 pm

Hammer_Time wrote:I think Windows 8 is great for Touch-enabled devices like Tablets etc.


I do agree here BUT: they are too expensive compared to Android tablets.
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Re: Windows 8 - opinion

Postby DIREWOLF75 » Thu Jul 25, 2013 2:53 pm

What W8 means?

That we should sit down, shut up and Wait... :mrgreen:

But W8 isn't stupidly bad

Yes it is.

Example, W8 works best with a touch screen, well on another forum someone noted that because of this they had tried testing it for a whole section in his company... Fast forward a month and that section is suddenly riddled with people with aching backs and pains in arms and shoulders. Because trying to work at a touch screen is ridiculously bad ergonomy. W8 was not surprisingly uninstalled with extreme prejudice. The company could not afford the sharp drop in productivity if not using touch screens, and could not afford the drastic increase in medical problems that using touch screens caused.

to transition the masses to the new interfaces

I do not want new interfaces. At least not as long as they are worse than what we already have. And W8 interface sucks.
I should not be forced to try an average of 4 times to make a command be recognised correctly by the OS. That is pathetically poor design, nothing else.

and give sufficient time for all the program makers to deliver a working usable program.

You mean force everyone to aquire all their programs from the MS appshop? So they can extort even more money from us while enforcing a "MS EVERYWHERE" paradigm?
Sorry, but that is 100% disadvantage.

the opportunity for the new venture into the next generation computing that Windows 8 represents.

What next generation? W8 is a substandard example of trying to follow the latest trends and be oh so bling and fashionable instead of creating something that works.

Windows 7's "perfection"

Regarding user interface, Win XP is better. It´s just that 7 has things like full support of SSD and 64-bitness going for it.

is that Windows 7 style GUI is done with

Why? That assertion has no logical basis. W8 GUI is markedly worse, counter intuitive and sometimes plain outright idiotic, it is not a next generation, it´s a load of shit with lots of promotion trying to make you think it´s better because it looks like on smaller portables.

PS - I have yet to use Windows 8 full time, just used it briefly now and then while helping relatives fix their issues.

Me too. And i dread the fact that my dad just got a new system with W8 on it, because that means my ability to help him with stuff just about disappears.
And my poor aunt is NOT happy with W8, nor am i since it takes ridiculous amount of time to take care of anything on it.
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Re: Windows 8 - opinion

Postby Fuzz » Thu Jul 25, 2013 5:27 pm

You know why a window manager is used on every major OS? Because it works. It has worked for 30 years. Being able to move, resize minimize, maximize, navigate running programs through a taskbar or something similar has evolved into a UI that is very effective. The crappy parts have gone away, and the good parts have been refined into something incredibly efficient. No one has ever complained about having the option for to much flexibility.

Throwing that all out the window so you can have a consistent look across devices is a horrible move. Its like, hey my car has a steering wheel, and that works really well, so maybe I should put a steering wheel on my bike too! No, you shouldn't! They are different devices used for different things! Not being able to put a program window where I want on a 24" monitor(or 3) for UI consistency with a 4 inch phone is not a good design decision. Its a horrible one and they should be told that. And you know what? The market is telling them. They've devastated the PC market, scared the hell out of Enterprise, and stabbed their OEM partners in the back. And that last one just turned around a bit them in their own ass, because Windows RT sucks and nobody wants their overpriced tablet.

its not just riled up nerds resisting change because change sucks. There are really good reasons why metro is horrible on the classic desktop PC.
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Re: Windows 8 - opinion

Postby Hammer_Time » Thu Jul 25, 2013 11:05 pm

Very much agree with Dire and Fuzz's comments above.

Change is fine, as long as the change has "major tangible benefit(s)" to the user. If not, the user will resist it. That is simple human nature.

I see that M$ recently slashed the price of Surface RT tablets cuz nobody is buying them... :lol: ( not cuz W8 sucks, because the ARM version of W8 ( Windows RT or "RunTime" ) does not support any traditional x86 apps, and the Windows RT App Store has very few apps ( compared to the Android or Apple AppStores ) , so consumers don't see the value in a Windows RT device for those 2 major reasons. Personally I think "Windows 8 RT" is doomed, but time will tell... ( same as RIM's proprietary "Playbook" has flopped in the marketplace, mainly due to lack of apps compared to Apple and Android ).
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Re: Windows 8 - opinion

Postby Sauron_Daz » Fri Jul 26, 2013 12:30 am

We never think of us as being one of Them. We are always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.
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Re: Windows 8 - opinion

Postby Stupify » Fri Jul 26, 2013 6:00 am

guys i am not saying Windows 8 is a great OS but rather all along I am saying it is a beta testing os, and a perfect time/opportunity for ms to test is when it is preceded by a near perfect os - windows 7. how else can ms test out the os for so many use cases? they obviously should realize now that they need to have a core kernel and components but option of two different GUI - potentially able to run concurrently.
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Re: Windows 8 - opinion

Postby Fuzz » Fri Jul 26, 2013 7:35 am

The problem is they haven't learned. They had a big beta test that ran for a long time before release, and everyone warned them. They didn't listen. With 8.1, they still aren't listening. They aren't testing the waters, they are attempting to move oceans.
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Re: Windows 8 - opinion

Postby DIREWOLF75 » Thu Oct 17, 2013 5:43 pm

Me too. And i dread the fact that my dad just got a new system with W8 on it

Funny update, my dad still can´t use his new computer, because he can´t make it work. And since i can´t talk him through it over the phone(because 1, W8 is nearly impossible to do that since telling how to do certain gestures for commands is ridiculously hard and 2, i simply can´t recall all the stupid strangeness the OS runs by), and live too far away to go there, he´s basically waiting for my brother to help out.
And he´s uber busy being da big boss nowadays.

So, several months, and he´s still stuck using his old 3Ghz P4 Celeron with 1GB RAM(and 128MB used for integrated gfx, nope i had nothing to do with him getting such a dreadful system).
A system that doesn´t even function properly.
Only because W8 sucks so badly in regards to user interface.
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Re: Windows 8 - opinion

Postby Hammer_Time » Thu Oct 17, 2013 6:29 pm

Email this link to him, mebbe it will help a bit:

http://www.dummies.com/how-to/content/w ... sheet.html
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Re: Windows 8 - opinion

Postby DIREWOLF75 » Thu Oct 17, 2013 8:21 pm

Hammer_Time wrote:Email this link to him, mebbe it will help a bit:

http://www.dummies.com/how-to/content/w ... sheet.html

Even i cant remember a tenth of that. And those swipe motions? Yeah right! I tried to work out how to properly do that on my aunts system and i just can figure out how to do it. And i´m a person who starts working with new programs the moment i sit down and see them the first time...

And most importantly, his biggest problem is that it refuses to connect to his internet.
Despite his internet being a 100% solid, reliable and previously just "hook up the cables and it works" ADSL connection.

Calling W8 pathetic is too nice. Way too nice. Calling it an affront to humanity probably comes closer to what it deserves.
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Re: Windows 8 - opinion

Postby Hammer_Time » Thu Oct 17, 2013 11:06 pm

:lol:

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Re: Windows 8 - opinion

Postby Sauron_Daz » Fri Oct 18, 2013 2:40 am

DIREWOLF75 wrote:Calling W8 pathetic is too nice. Way too nice. Calling it an affront to humanity probably comes closer to what it deserves.


:lol: :lol: :twisted: :lol:
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Re: Windows 8 - opinion

Postby Sauron_Daz » Fri Oct 18, 2013 2:40 am

Hammer_Time wrote:
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True that..
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Re: Windows 8 - opinion

Postby Hammer_Time » Mon Oct 28, 2013 2:55 pm

http://betanews.com/2013/10/28/windows- ... ts-new-os/

Windows 8.1's Calculator app sums up what's wrong with Microsoft's new OS


As I said all along , Windows 8.x is great on a tablet or other mobile device with a touch screen, but on a desktop pc it leaves much to be desired...
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Re: Windows 8 - opinion

Postby DIREWOLF75 » Mon Oct 28, 2013 4:20 pm

Hammer_Time wrote:http://betanews.com/2013/10/28/windows-8-1s-calculator-app-sums-up-whats-wrong-with-microsofts-new-os/

Windows 8.1's Calculator app sums up what's wrong with Microsoft's new OS


As I said all along , Windows 8.x is great on a tablet or other mobile device with a touch screen, but on a desktop pc it leaves much to be desired...


It´s no better on a desktop regardless of touch screen, because if you try using a touch screen much with a desktop? Say hello to ouchies in your arm, shoulder and back.

Idiots.
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Re: Windows 8 - opinion

Postby Tiggerz » Mon Oct 28, 2013 9:35 pm

I use windows 8.1 on both a desktop and a surface pro. Personally I don't use the apps (modern UI) and I don't know anyone that does (for business purposes). I think the mistake is merging the two interfaces together - Modern UI would be great on an RT tablet device, but desktop needs to remain desktop on everything else. I don't mind some of the gestures and things like that (swipe in from edge, move mouse to corner etc) but APPs don't cut it as business software in my book - Win32 still outperforms functionality wise.
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Re: Windows 8 - opinion

Postby Hammer_Time » Tue Oct 29, 2013 1:51 am

Agreed.

This is why I am writing my own desktop OS based off IBM's OS/2 Warp :mrgreen: :lol: I am having trouble getting licensing rights from M$ to use DirectX though... :cry:

http://techland.time.com/2012/04/02/25- ... ng-system/

Even Bill Gates was a fan of OS/2! ( see button on his jacket ) :

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The July 1987 issue of PC World magazine featured a centerfold (!) of Microsoft CEO Bill Gates proudly sporting an OS/2 button
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