Need help for repair my Ati Hd7950

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Need help for repair my Ati Hd7950

Postby Filrond » Sun Mar 31, 2013 3:34 pm

I buyed months ago, a HD7950 Card with 3GB in local Shop.

I used this card in Old computer 775 with Msi motherboard, and Vga work fine.

I Update this computer to 1155 system with Core I7 2600 and Asrock Extreme 4 P67 B3 motherboard.

Ati Hd7950 no work with this system. I tested it in other 1155 system with Pci 3 Gen and no work.

Finally I send message for help to Amd. Finally a lot of send messages replies to Amd.

I discovery, I was a great swindled. My local shop sold my a Dell Vga Hd7950 Card...... This card is no for sell in local shop, is card for sell with Dell Computers.

My card only work in Pci Express 16x working at 8X. No work in motherboards with Pci Express 16x at 16x .

Then I decide check my Vga Hd7950, and then I found problem...

Two smd components (Resistor or Capacimeter), missing in Card.

This Two smd components, are in the area of PCI Express Vga connector with the motherboard (where the pins). This missing Smd no appears broken, this missing Smd appears removed by Dell for use Vga at 8X in Computer Dell.

I look in google, other users problems with Vga Card only work at 8x Pci Express 16x, finally found exact problem with missing Smd components in the same zone Vga.

I have a Electronic Solder Skills. I have a Station solder and large experience with repair electronic components. Is easy for me resolder this two smd components.

But, I have a problem. I do not know who exactly are these Two SMDs.

1)Are resistor or capacimeter?.
2)And what is electronic value for this Resistor or Capacimeter?.


I have looked, this smd appears are standart in all Pci Express Vga Cards... but not sure.

I have a Dead Hd4890, and I can remove this two Smd from this Broken Hd4890 and later solder in my Hd7950..

But I prefer to be sure, these components are the same and have the same value.

Do any of you, known to be and what value do they have?.

I added Pics for my Vga Card and for Zone hardware problem and missing Two Smd.

My Card:

Image

Image

Two Smd Zone missing/Damage Pic from my Vga Card:

Image



Other Pic from Google with Reference Card Hd7950. (All Smd in Zone)

Image

Image

Other Pic from Google with Hd7950 Twin Frozer (All Smd in Zone)

Image



Thanks for help
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Re: Need help for repair my Ati Hd7950

Postby Sauron_Daz » Mon Apr 01, 2013 12:41 am

Those look to be resistors. Can't you see anything printed on them?
Or take one off and measure it through with a multitester.
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Re: Need help for repair my Ati Hd7950

Postby Hammer_Time » Mon Apr 01, 2013 3:59 am

He was greatly swindled!! :fist: :evil: :x

I am not sure if his card can be "fixed" but if I come across any relevant info I will post it here...
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Are Capacitors.

Postby Filrond » Mon Apr 01, 2013 7:19 am

I found Vga HD4850 Pics and in this components, pcb put: CXXX ...

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/P.../back_full.jpg

C is for Capacitors.

This components are Capacitors.

Now only need value for this Capacitors.

Vga Car Hd7950 no work in 1155 computers and 775 systems with PciExpress 16x. Black screen.

Only work fine on Msi motherboards at moment. In my Old 775 Msi motherboard and in a friend Dual Xeon 771 Msi Motherboard.

Other computer try init Vga at 16X, then no work, no image.

I update my computer to 1155 system with Core I7 2600, I need repair Vga for use.

Greetings.
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Re: Need help for repair my Ati Hd7950

Postby Fuzz » Mon Apr 01, 2013 3:39 pm

I'd guess that there is a reason 16x was disabled in the first place. Reactivating it may just destroy the card. Has anyone else successfully done this mod? If not, I'd be wary of doing it on something I paid for. Personally I'd take it back to the store.
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Re: Need help for repair my Ati Hd7950

Postby clone » Mon Apr 01, 2013 4:32 pm

I am not sure if his card can be "fixed" but if I come across any relevant info I will post it here.
I'd guess that there is a reason 16x was disabled in the first place. Reactivating it may just destroy the card. Has anyone else successfully done this mod? If not, I'd be wary of doing it on something I paid for. Personally I'd take it back to the store.
I'm thinking it's more than just a matter of some missing hardware and that the card's bios will be the bigger problem... because it's a Dell exclusive card/bios can it be swapped and with what bios in order for it to work?

I'm assuming he can't return the card.

personally I'd try it find a PCIe 8x mobo that supports the newer core processors and be done with it instead of potentially destroying the card.

your only other options are to either talk to Dell and see if they will do some kind of trade or talk to the computer store and and see if they will allow you to see the PCB on a regular HD 7950 so you can compare and get the part id's.

if the card is still under warranty then kill it in a way that leaves no physical damage and get a replacement.... chances are they'll just send you a regular card.
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Re: Are Capacitors.

Postby Sauron_Daz » Mon Apr 01, 2013 11:18 pm

Filrond wrote:I found Vga HD4850 Pics and in this components, pcb put: CXXX ...

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/P.../back_full.jpg

C is for Capacitors.

This components are Capacitors.

Now only need value for this Capacitors.

Vga Car Hd7950 no work in 1155 computers and 775 systems with PciExpress 16x. Black screen.

Only work fine on Msi motherboards at moment. In my Old 775 Msi motherboard and in a friend Dual Xeon 771 Msi Motherboard.

Other computer try init Vga at 16X, then no work, no image.

I update my computer to 1155 system with Core I7 2600, I need repair Vga for use.

Greetings.


You link brings me nowhere.

I doubt adding some capacitors will result in a 16x card.. as others mention it may be locked in the BIOS for a reason..
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Re: Need help for repair my Ati Hd7950

Postby Hammer_Time » Tue Apr 02, 2013 1:37 am

Or he could be really evil and just sell it used under a fake name and swindle somebody else the way he was swindled...and buy a proper 7950...but that is wrong, two wrongs don't make a "right" and karma will come back to bite him in the arse someday...
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Re: Need help for repair my Ati Hd7950

Postby Sauron_Daz » Tue Apr 02, 2013 2:12 am

And that can be quite painful..
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Re: Need help for repair my Ati Hd7950

Postby DIREWOLF75 » Tue Apr 02, 2013 3:56 am

You link brings me nowhere.

He copied it incorrectly. It´s missing the middle part.

I doubt adding some capacitors will result in a 16x card.. as others mention it may be locked in the BIOS for a reason..

Yeah, just a few caps are very unlikely to do much difference by themselves. Card BIOS is the likely primary culprit.
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The problem solution is on the way

Postby Filrond » Thu Apr 04, 2013 5:15 pm

Hello Again. Thanks for all responses. At this moment, I am waiting for arrive capacitors for repair my Hd7950.

In Overclockers forum, Member user [COLOR="Black"][COLOR="Red"]"Bobnova"[/COLOR][/COLOR] said me this response, with value for this Capacitors.

[SIZE="3"][COLOR="Red"]Bobnova Said:[/COLOR][/SIZE]

" Those are [SIZE="3"]0.1µF, 0402 package capacitors[/SIZE]. If you replace them, should work fine.
It looks like the pads are still there, so you just need to get some caps and solder them on. The tricky part of course is that they're ****** [SIZE="3"]Any voltage rating over 5v or so is fine.[/SIZE]

[SIZE="3"]I'm surprised it works at 8x, as those pairs are for 3x and 4x respectively.[/SIZE] ".

I look in google with key " 0.1µF 0402 package capacitors Pci Express " and with " 100NF *(100NF=0.1µF)* 0402 package capacitors Pci Express and found a various links with other people with same problem or similar problem, and the responses and final fixes were obtained with this
0.1µF 0402 package capacitors.

I found too, a April 30 Year 2005 Archive Datasheet Pdf, with Official Technical Data for PciExpress from Philips Semiconductors.

Archive Name is: AN10373_1.pdf

In the archive say this:

"PCI Express requires AC coupling between transmitter and receiver. The AC coupling capacitors for both differential pair signals must be the same value, same package size, and have symmetric placement. If possible, TX traces should route on the top layer.

The capacitor value must be in the range of 75 nF to 200 nF [B][SIZE="3"](100 nF is best). The 0402 package size is preferred[/SIZE]
, and 0603 is acceptable. C-pack is not allowed.
[/B]
The breakout into and out of capacitors should be symmetrical for both signal lines in a differential pair. The trace separation for routing to pads must be minimized in order to optimize tight coupling between the signal pairs."

The best option is 100Nf and with package 0402... Sure this Hd7950 Card was built with the best components.

I look for this capacitors and on Ebay, usa seller sell me for 9 Euros (with transport cost included), 100 unity of "Murata" 0.1Uf capacitors 0402 10V X7R (45 To 125 temperature support).


[SIZE="3"]When Vga no work with other motherboards, I look for information in google. Possible Dell Block bios, was my first option.[/SIZE]

My Card is Dell, but with Amd Reference Original Desing. Then I flashed my Card with Official Bios Update from Amd, (Tahiti Pro Bios June 2012 for update speed clock and memory and Improve Hd7950 performance).

Problem with only work 8x no solved. Is no possible solved, problem is in hardware, without these capacitor,Vga is impossible work in a 16X Slot Pci Express at 16X Speed.

Vga only work in two Msi Mainboards: My Old 775 Msi board and Dual Xeon Quadcore (8 Cores Total) mainboard 5000X Speedster2-A4V from friend.

No work in my Asrock 1155 P67 Extreme 4 B3, no work in my brother Asrock 1155 Z68 Pro 3 Gen 3.

No work In Gigabyte X38 Dq6 (only work for a time in second Pci Express, but in a moment, black screen on windows and no work more in this motherboard and too X48 Dq6 Motherboard).

No work in Asus P5LD2 Se, no work in Asus P5E Deluxe, no work in Dual Opteron mainboard Tyan Tiger K8WE (Friend computers and my all computers).

Without update flash and with update flash to last Amd version official bios, Vga no solved problem with blocked run at only 8X. Repeat, was a hardware problem, without this Pci Express capacitors, Vga is impossible work in 16X.


Thanks to all, for all help. When capacitors arrive me, And I get the card repair, I confirm repair with message in this topic.

Greetings
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buff... I am now confused

Postby Filrond » Thu Apr 04, 2013 6:07 pm

I now receive message for Hardforum user airthimble with this Pdf,[b]is writed for Pci Express, Pci-Sig:[/color]

http://www.pcisig.com/developers/main/training_materials/get_document?doc_id=0a73787e8b6cc2b746ba2c2140a4ed768e93e9df

And say: "

As the next generation of PCI Express is defined, the information throughput will double and yet the symbolrate will only move from 5 GT/s to 8 GT/s. There are some significant changes and challenges:
While 5 GT/s communications used 8b/10b encoding to limit the longest occurrences of consecutive 1’s and 0’s, 8 GT/s will use scrambling.


This has system budget and signal integrity impact on both transmitter and receivers. Baseline wander due to the long runs of consecutive 1’s and 0’swill impact the available eye height.

AC coupling capacitors of 220 nF will be required in order to reduce the baseline wander.

The combination of higher datarate and channel length up to 20”combine to cause Inter Symbol Interference (ISI), in addition tojitter from reference clocks and transmitters. These will limit the eye opening width available".

Thanks and Greetings
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Re: Need help for repair my Ati Hd7950

Postby Hammer_Time » Fri Apr 05, 2013 4:32 pm

Interesting... good luck with the new caps and let us know the results please! :)
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Re: Need help for repair my Ati Hd7950

Postby Sauron_Daz » Sat Apr 06, 2013 12:00 am

So the capacitors are needed to clean up the signals passing through them so just the data is regarded to be data, data in the form of a change in voltage.
Well, I'm curious if adding/replacing those capacitors will result in a card that can handle a 16x data stream where it can handle only an 8x data stream now..
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VGA 7950 CARD IS COMPLETE REPAIRED

Postby Filrond » Sat Apr 27, 2013 4:15 pm

:D

Thanks to User Bobnova in overclockers forum.

Thanks to User airthimble in hardforum forum.

Thanks to all users in all forums for responses to my thread message.

UPDATE:

VGA HD7950 CARD IS COMPLETE REPAIR. WORK FINE AT 16X AND WORK FINE NOW IN ALL COMPUTERS.


SMD CAPACITORS ARE 220NF 0402 PACKAGE

I BUYED THIS CAPACITORS:

0402 X7R 6.3V

CAPACITOR CERAMIC 0.22UF 6.3V, X7R, 10%, 0402
Capacitance: 0.22µF
Capacitance Tolerance: ± 10%
Dielectric Characteristic: X7R
Voltage Rating: 6.3V
Capacitor Case Style: 0402 ^1005 Metric]
Operating Temperature Range: -55°C to +125°C
Capacitor Terminals: SMD
No. of Pins: 2

NEXT, I carry my card with buyed capacitors to my City local and Spanish Internet Electronic Repair/Sell shop IMPEXTROM. They solded capacitors with high quality machinery. I Have a station solder with pistol gun, but I prefer electronic professional from IMPEXTROM, with better machines, solder this components in delicate pcb Vga.

All ok. Card is complete Tested and working now fine.

Greetings.
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Re: Need help for repair my Ati Hd7950

Postby Sauron_Daz » Mon Apr 29, 2013 1:22 am

So it works! :D
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Re: Need help for repair my Ati Hd7950

Postby Fuzz » Mon Apr 29, 2013 5:28 am

Wow, nice work! I wonder why Dell would have left those off? Yet another reason not to buy their stuff....
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Re: Need help for repair my Ati Hd7950

Postby DIREWOLF75 » Mon Apr 29, 2013 9:43 am

Fuzz wrote:Wow, nice work! I wonder why Dell would have left those off? Yet another reason not to buy their stuff....

To make sure it only works where they want it to work of course.
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Re: Need help for repair my Ati Hd7950

Postby Hammer_Time » Mon Apr 29, 2013 2:20 pm

:shock:

EXCELLENT!!! 8) :D

To be honest, I was quite skeptical that simply soldering on some capacitors would properly "fix" your card to run at 16x mode instead of 8x mode. However, it WORKED!! :shock: 8) :D :D

Image

Now you can game happily with your new cpu and mobo... sweet!

Thank you very much for sharing the detailed info with all of us, perhaps there is another soul at there who got "swindled" with one of these Dell custom 8x PCIe cards and now has the correct information to modify it into a 16x card!! :reading: :scout:

Happy gaming and hope you decide to hang around the forums from time to time in the future...
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Re: Need help for repair my Ati Hd7950

Postby Sauron_Daz » Mon Apr 29, 2013 11:49 pm

Fuzz wrote:Wow, nice work! I wonder why Dell would have left those off? Yet another reason not to buy their stuff....


To sell them cheaper? Or to create a need for an upgrade?
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